Back in January, Craig and Gareth met with James Osborne of The Recruitment Network to talk about the current state of technology in the recruitment sector.

Covering topics such as integrations, artificial intelligence and the importance of digital transformation in the growth of your business.


Very good. Good.  afternoon. Yeah, it’s 12:30. Good afternoon, everybody.

Hope you’re all well, Thank you for joining us on today’s,  LinkedIn Live. As you know, we run these regularly, catching up with different industry experts, and non-experts, as the case may be for today, (just thought I’d drop that one in there straight away), friends at TRN and anyone else who can help us understand what’s going on in the world of recruitment, how we can improve our business strategy and our growth plans and navigate forward.

And today we’re gonna focus on technology.

There is a slight irony, and I’m gonna drop it in before they do.

The last time I did one of these LinkedIn Lives, my technology went down. So there we go.

I’m the last person to be probably talking about this, but anyway,

I’m gonna give it a go anyway.

And which is why we do bring experts and guests on with us as well. So,

Today we wanna talk about the future of technology and about how you can expand your business with technology.

So, looking at your sort of business development strategy, your business strategy, your growth strategy and how tech sits alongside that as part of that journey.

I think there’s a lot of conversations going around at the moment about what on earth is going on with technology, where we start to work with AI and automations, and everything else goes with that.

So hopefully we can try and help, sort of navigate through some of that minefield of questions that some of you may have. If you do have any questions as we’re going today, please, feel free to ask them in the chat or in the in the Q&A section and we’ll make sure we drop these things, um, into [the conversation]. 

[Let’s]  introduce our our guest. So, today we’ve got the the guys from The Possibility Partnership, I think it’s a genius name for a business, ho are the all-in-one tech partner for businesses. And,  and one of one of our TRN partners as well.

So whether you’re needing cloud solutions, app development or on-the-ground tech leadership, their job is to partner with you in your business and help you transform that relationship you have with technology. Good, bad and ugly. 

The team is led by,  two very talented techies (they told me to say that). Craig Bell, and Gareth Nichol, and if any of you want to follow up with these guys afterwards, have a look at their website – – It’s a great fun website just to have a look around and play with. And just about everything else as well. As much as all the insights are on there.

So, Gareth, Craig, thanks for joining us today. How are you guys doing? You’re all good?

Craig & G: 

Good, thanks, you?


Um, yeah, very good. Thank you.

So I’m very nervous about the next 25 minutes, having met you and spoken with you and stuff.

And I know how weird you both are. And the fact that one of you actually does Rubix Cubes via Bluetooth. I think it’s just in itself insanity in itself, I think it demonstrates a little about the level of technology we’ve got in the in the room. Which is great.

Let’s just quickly kick off. I suppose and sort of get into the conversation.

So let’s take a big step back.

First of all, I think it’d be fair to say the world of technology is a bit of a minefield for a lot of businesses, especially small businesses, for that matter as well.

What are some of the I suppose problems, challenges that you’re seeing businesses, recruitment companies, obviously, in particular, are facing when it comes to that technology journey. Let’s call it that.


Yeah, absolutely. So I think a lot of what we see is companies growing, and they sort of make do and muddle. So we see lots of companies that start at maybe five employees, and by the time they hit 50 they’re still using the same collaboration suite. They’re still using the same CRM, if at all. Maybe spreadsheets. They’ve got someone in a back room somewhere, doing all their finance and spreadsheets and paying people, you know, individually.
Just really, really inhibited growth because of that tech.
We see lack of integration: So there might be that, you know, we see ATSs or CRMs not talking to finance packages. We see telephony solutions either not existing, loads of recruitment consultants just sat still bashing their mobile phones, rather than using an integrated telephony solution.


And I think you kind of touched on it earlier as well before we joined; Technology is moving so quickly, and I think those leaders within recruitment typically aren’t tech leaders, right? They are doing what they enjoy, that’s owning a recruitment business.
It’s executing that strategy, but they don’t live and breathe that Bluetooth Rubix Cube, you know? Or the generative AI, or the home automations, or you know, that crazy stuff that allows you then to draw on that industry expertise.

And I think that’s probably where we come in and facilitate that.


No, for sure. But when you say these are problems like things like integrations and stuff I mean, what?

What’s the problem behind it?

If the systems are all working really well independently.

Yes, There’s a bit of admin in between. And that type of stuff.

What’s the big deal?. Why is it a problem?


It’s time, money and error as a result of both.

So the time to, you know, duplicate re-enter, rekey. We’ve seen it before where people have actually completed a manual timesheet. You know, the worst case would be you’ve got a manual timesheet that they sent us to key in.

It could be onboarding. Traditionally, some recruitment sectors would have paper-based onboarding processes, and again that would then key that into a CRM.

Then manual timesheets faxed in, emailed in, whatever it might be – key that in.

So it’s really, for me. I think the key to recruitment is almost check the ego. You don’t need it.
It’s not about having 50 people, 60 people, 70 people. It’s actually about effectively utilising the resources that you have and those people, right, giving them the tools to be empowered, to have that technology to enable them to do that. 

And I think that’s the struggle I see in the industry that it is quite an egotistical industry and typically people want to, you know, “all my businesses they’ve got 60 people, so many people”. The fact that they’re spending most of their day duplicating tasks. That’s the bit we we try and,  demystify, I guess.


Yeah, I think I probably agree with you.

Go back a year. It may, I may have been right. I think probably 2023 taught a lot of people that actually, like, if you’re gonna have lots of people in your business, make them feel there’s probably less,  less from an operational perspective in theory.

But in in in essence, though, surely I can just go out and get, like, Zapier and that type of stuff and build a whole load of zaps to do all that for me and just get all my systems talking together because it’s quite simple now, right? I mean, you can be a Luddite and know how to use technology.


That’s the issue. A lot of companies, Yeah, So a lot of companies think they know what’s wrong because they’re they’re living it and that’s definitely, you know, a valued insight. But they don’t always see. They don’t know what they don’t know. So they don’t know the full picture. They don’t know what maybe they are missing. 

We’ve worked with some customers in the past where they’ve been through big digital transformations, put loads of effort into fixing something that freed up one person when actually there was a big issue that would have freed up 1-20 you know, 30 people’s time, even if it was 5-10 minutes a day. But the sort of cumulative effect of fixing that issue would have been significantly better for the business than focusing on freeing up that one person’s time.

And sometimes it’s that squeaky wheel situation, right? It’s the person that keeps shouting about something, saying,”I wish this was better for me”. The key is to block out all of that noise and take a more holistic view. Really understand what it is within the business that’s not working.

So yes, as a business owner, you could go out. You could find some zaps you could use MAKE to automate some of those tasks, but you might not be taking into consideration everything you should. Now are you thinking about data security? Are you thinking about the impact that’s gonna have on your revenue, on your retention rates? Those sorts of things,


I guess, to your point, James as well. You talk about Zapier or MAKE, which is probably our preferred,  integration. That’s not necessarily the wrong answer, right? Right. It’s actually about having that joined-up view of the world. Is that appropriate? We often refer to Build Buy or Partner. So do you build it yourself? Do you buy it in, Zapier, right? Or do you partner with somebody else and just outsource that entire task? Whether that be, I don’t know, digital marketing or finance or whatever it might be.

So maybe Zapier is entirely appropriate. And that’s the kind of whole, holistic joined-up view that strategic, tech roadmap, I guess.


Ok, that’s interesting. so let’s just touch on that a second, because obviously one of the biggest cost of applications for a lot of businesses around – outside of sort of staff, LinkedIn, licences, rent. And then you’re probably talking about your CRM system or anything else.

So with that, with that in mind, there’s some of the CRM systems out there are investing heavily at the moment. They’re buying up lots of other businesses, they’re consolidating. Bring them all together. Should we should our tech journey just be driven by our CRM partner?

We let them do it and spend like… the classic example is AI, and automations. And if you look at some of the tech artners out there in the CRM systems, they’re pumping millions and millions of pounds worth of investment and time and resource into really understanding automations.

So is it best for an SME recruitment business leader to basically go… “Well, you know what? I’ll let you guys get on with it, and I’ll just you just let me know what I need to know when I need to know it and what system I can use”, or should we be bringing people like yourself in and saying “Actually, no, there’s more to it than just that.”


“No. They should just always bring us in.”


How much of your day is realistically spent in that CRM tool? How much of your workflow is governed by that? You know, a lot of, a lot of businesses are spending, maybe it’s 50% of their time in their CRM tool, but that other 50% might be on their telephony platform.Might be using emails. Might be collaborating, having meetings. So it’s not just about the CRM and the ATS piece. It’s about making sure that that whole journey, that whole workflow that you have as a business marries together and is as seamless as possible. So, yes, you could rely on the CRM guiding and pushing you in that direction, but I think it’s as I said earlier, it’s the holistic piece.


I guess another angle to that as well right is that if you take a product placement, if you take Bullhorn, who’s got a big marketplace. You know they keep acquiring various different other companies. That’s fine. But then do you not just become one of another that executes the same tech stack?

What’s your key USP, is potentially that you don’t follow the sheep and have the same CRM. Sure I get that. But then all the little bits of you know around it maybe something that’s different. To be that kind of differentiator. 


OK. So what’s stopping recruitment organisations scaling up their technology at the same rate of pace as their business itself? Do you think because, as you said, you know, some people’s technology stacks are pretty archaic? Archaic is probably a bit of a harsh word, but maybe a few years old and potentially not fit for purpose in this current marketplace. So what what slows people down and prevents people from from doing that?


I think it’s just lack of awareness.  you know, it’s having the conversations.

It’s like you know what we’re doing now, right? It’s highlighting the need.

It’s giving people the option and the ability to not necessarily follow the herd and go with that CRM and bashing the mobile phones for X number of hours a day, or whatever it is that is is in vogue at a particular point in time.

So I think it’s it’s that it’s that not having necessarily an IT team, ’cause you know it doesn’t warrant it right.  The cost of a CTO, the cost of an IT director, it’s bringing in a fractional CTO. It’s having those conversations and 50% of our business, (a bit of a shame to plug now), but 50% of our business comes from the recruitment sector. So if we’ve seen it one place, odds are we’re gonna see it again and again and again. So it’s actually being able to leverage and almost, you know, almost a cookie cutter ’cause each time you want to have it unique.  But you’ve got that wealth of knowledge, and that’s something that a growing business wouldn’t necessarily have, right?


For sure!


I think to add to that, it’s it’s the perceived priority piece. We think a lot of, a lot of recruitment businesses focus on, getting candidates out, getting perm hires in, getting the high volume, low margin jobs out there. And tech isn’t always seen as an enabler, a facilitator, or a priority for that business.
It’s “We need to get the client”, “we need to get the candidates”, and “we need to fulfil that obligation”. 

And sometimes the tech is forgotten about, people forget how much easier the tech can make it. 

And people also just put up with bad tech.

You know, if you stand in an office of 20 people for a full day, I could guarantee you’ll hear at least five or six grumbles in that day of people saying “God, I wish this was easier” or “I hate that this does this”, but they don’t really do anything about it. It just carries on day in, day out. And…


Typically people find workarounds.

That’s one of our biggest kind of pet peeves that you go out down to the work onto the work floor and start actually chatting with people, they’ve always got these kind of crappy little hacks, you know, life hack workarounds that really shouldn’t be there.


Yeah, really difficult to share data with a particular customer. Sure, I’ll just pop a CV on WhatsApp and send it over to them.

It’s it’s not great from a data protection point of view, and it’s making sure, if people had the right tools, you maintain that data security and you make that workflow easier. And the client gets a great experience, too.


It’s interesting. The way you described recruitment, by the way is I sort of agree and disagree with, by the way, it’s interesting and I’m not judging you. It’s based on your experiences. But one of the things that we’re definitely seeing a lot more of in the last couple of years is that recruitment business is shifting away from traditional recruitment services.
So, as you described it, perm, contract et cetera, and offering a much more, much wider church of services and products, including consultancy service and everything else. And I think that we’re starting to see some really interesting examples of recruitment businesses start to build technology platforms of their own to support their product offering that’s going to market, and I think that’s quite exciting, I think.

Are you seeing some of that in in some of the clients that you’ve worked with?


It’s interesting. The way you described recruitment, by the way is I sort of agree and disagree with, by the way, it’s interesting and I’m not judging you. It’s based on your experiences. But one of the things that we’re definitely seeing a lot more of in the last couple of years is that recruitment business is shifting away from traditional recruitment services.
So, as you described it, perm, contract et cetera, and offering a much more, much wider church of services and products, including consultancy service and everything else. And I think that we’re starting to see some really interesting examples of recruitment businesses start to build technology platforms of their own to support their product offering that’s going to market, and I think that’s quite exciting, I think.

Are you seeing some of that in in some of the clients that you’ve worked with?


Can I not just use Open AI and Chat GPT to build apps for you now? 


To write your app? You can try.


Well, people are trying. Definitely.


I wouldn’t use Open AI and Chat GPT for that, though. I don’t know. We have got you know, similarly, we have actually had quite significant experience of Chat GPT recently. Is it OK to talk about custom GPTs and some of the other stuff?


Yeah, absolutely. In fact, Charlie’s actually asked a question about sort of, AI and stuff.

Is there any particular AI products that help save time when resourcing other than just using them just to write content and advert writing that sort of stuff?



So I answer that first, and then we’ll come back to the second part, which was around the stuff we’ve done.

So a couple of years ago, we took a view that one of our kind of basic entry services is licensing. So we took the view that you’re either gonna be on Microsoft or you’re gonna be on Google, right? It’s unlikely you’re gonna be using Lotus Notes 123 from the ’80s’ anymore.
So by being able to offer Microsoft licencing or Google licencing, we can pretty much 100% provide licensing to any recruitment company.
So Google came out with their AI, Duet, which is their kind of, their embedded AI that gives you that end-to-end. It can write your slides for you. It can book appointments automatically with, you know, with people, whether it be suppliers, candidates, whatever it might be.,And then similarly, Copilot launched very, very recently within  Microsoft. And that’s their Chat GPT OpenAI variant (and the Google version is actually based on Bard, which is their open source version)

So to get that, you know, rather than you’re right rather than just taking OpenAI setting yourself up as a user, getting it to spin out a poem about dogs or whatever it is that you need then somehow drop into a PowerPoint. Embedding the AI at that core system layer is the key, right?

It shouldn’t be a peripheral. It should be something that is part of that process. So I think hopefully that answers Charlie’s question.

And then the stuff we’ve been looking at recently was – there was a huge thing just before Christmas. Custom GPTs. That’s the ability to take Chat GPT, upload docs, train it around your specific requirements. The scenario we we took- we’ve got marketing telling us what we can and can’t say. We don’t always listen, But we’ve got our brand guidelines. And, you know, we blew that up into custom Chat GPT internally. So with that,  we then taught it all of our blog posts on our website by just literally pointing at it and going read these URLs – You know, these are good blog posts. SEOs, This is what we all need to consider when writing a blog post. And now we can literally go, “Right, This is the blog post that we want. This is the key message items that we want” and it will go back, read all our branding guidelines, takes the tone of voice even down to the colour creation via image by Dali, and we can spend nothing our blog posts that would have cost us a significant amount of money previously to outsource that, and we’ve got that quality ‘cause it it’s consumed all those learnings as well. So really custom laser focussed to our requirements.


Yeah, absolutely.

I’m a real big fan of these custom customised GPTs. I think they’re brilliant and I think you can you can really create every…. I think every recruiter should have a suite of custom GPTS set up/ built for them. So that heavy lifting and that sort of stuff. 

Charlie. There’s a couple of a couple of answers in the comments, by the way, about a couple of tools that you could have a look at sort of thing, um, around that. And I can share some stuff with you Charlie afterwards, by the way, some other example tools to have to think about.


So, I think, to to go back to Charlie’s question. I think the the key thing when trying to find something like an AI tool that will improve  a particular business process- like the resourcing. It’s figuring out which bits of that process, you know. Are you looking for an AI that does resourcing full stop. That’s what it does. It does all of that for you, Or actually, are you looking for something that will take data on your social media effectiveness and tell you this is the particular time of day that you should post this. Are you looking for something that, tells you what keywords to have in that particular post? It’s about picking apart that problem. Is the problem resourcing or, is the problem actually reach? Is it the number of applicants – are there too many, are there not enough? And it’s picking apart the problem rather than just saying I need a resource that’s an AI.

I think that’s where our value comes in. You know, you can go out and shop and buy a product off the shelf, but if you’re fixing a problem that’s not there. You might still have that same problem afterwards.


100%. Emily, in answer to your question, Yes,  Microsoft Copilot would in effect, do a similar thing about building your own custom GPT. So, yes, in answer to your question.
So, there’s another question that came in, actually, I’ll pass this back up to you guys.

So, um, as far as I know, it’s from David, “as far as I know only salesforce and the MS, Microsoft Dynamics fully integrate with LinkedIn Sales Navigator. Could you achieve that with Zoho recruit or any other ATS?”


LinkedIn’s a challenging one, obviously, because it’s owned by Microsoft. There are ways of doing it, most of them are frowned upon by by LinkedIn and Microsoft…


To the point where you get blocked or to the point where they…


…you need to be careful. We can advise offline. Maybe we’ve got the options available, but yeah, it’s maybe doing a LinkedIn live broadcast covering what’s good and bad on LinkedIn is probably not the right place,


David, may I suggest you reach out to these guys after the call for an off-the-record conversation.

So let’s talk about them moving forward and again with regards to some practical things that people need to do to go forward. I if I’m building up my tech stack moving forward, do I build it based on what’s happening at the moment, or do I build it on based on what I’m trying to become in 12 to 18 months time. Because obviously, by the time I build something today, it’s probably gonna be obsolete in about 12 months time anyway, sort of thing.

So how do you go about it? OK, I get your point. Guys. We need to do something with our tech and we take it seriously. What’s the starting point? Other than immediately reaching out to you two straight away. But no. Quite seriously, blank piece of paper moment. 

What do I do?

How do I start this process?


The first thing to do is to take stock.

You know, what have you got?

What haven’t you got? 

Have some real open frank conversations internally. Maybe as a business owner, you shouldn’t be in the room, you should nominate somebody else so that people are able to be candid.

Find out from people you know what is causing pain, what is causing issues? What’s not working for you? Maybe even have some conversations with trusted clients or candidates that you you’ve had good and bad experiences with. Just really understand where you should be spending that time and effort.

Tech digital transformation isn’t always the cheapest thing to do. And if you are going to go on this journey, then you should invest in a place where it actually counts.

I think, as you said at the start of the question-  Is it think forward?, or is it think about what you’ve got?. Now it’s both.

You know, if if you’re already on Microsoft, should you be considering a move to Google? – only if you’re dealing with an industry that would benefit from it. If you’re if you’re in finance recruitment, then sticking with Microsoft because most of your clients are Microsoft houses is a logical choice.
If you’re using Microsoft and all your customers are media companies who are probably on Google workspace, then it’s a logical move for you to move to Google Workspace instead, so that customer integration and communication is much,  much better and cleaner. So that’s a big decision to make.


Just explain it then. So I’ve got a system. I’ve got a sort of a communication system tech stack that all does all that sort of thing. My customers have got that. How how does the fact that I’ve got the same one to them mean it make it smoother and cleaner?


It’s just that alignment. It’s just a collaboration. Just simple things.

We hate the Zoom, right? We’re not particularly big on Zoom.  We use Calendly right for booking out appointments? So when somebody gets to pick,  calendar appointment, we use both Google and Microsoft for that. So it’s just that being able to enable your supplier to actually choose “I’m a Google house”, it’s so much easier if you work Google to Google. Whether that be sharing documents, collaboration, just simply joining a meeting, right? Not spending the first five minutes explaining how to unmute something.

We’ve all been there.

it’s just the simple foundations. And then building on that foundation is sector specific.


Yeah. I suppose you really need to understand what your sector is using to make that because that’s quite a big decision to make to make that this switch, right?


It’s definitely easier at the start when you’re a smaller business. You know, if you if if you’re 5, 10, 15 employees that’s a much easier change than 2000.

We’ve done both – and 5 to 10 is much easier.

Even moving back. We’ve seen customers move one way and then decide after a few years “This isn’t the choice for us, you know, actually, we missed aligned to our market, and now it’s causing us other issues.”

I think to to David’s question, there around summarising what a bot can do for a recruiter. I think some of the the areas where we find it most interesting is picking apart job descriptions, and identifying key phrases. This is particularly of use in really skilled industries. IT is a great example of this where recruiters may have a good understanding of the area that they’re recruiting into. But there could be 15 different ways of describing a particular type of technology. And if they don’t know all 15 of those, how do they find the candidate? Or do they miss candidates that would match?

So you can use AI to to pick apart those job descriptions, put together lists of profiles, you could create a custom GPT that even generated your  LinkedIn Boolean searches for skills.

You could build them out that way. One of the things that we find you’ve got to be really careful of, though, is that candidate selection piece. GDPR is really quite clear on what you can and cannot do – especially making decisions using AI.  And I think there’s a lot of risk for recruiters there,  where people get lazy and it’s like “I’m gonna just chuck a load of CVs into Chat GPT. I don’t know where they’re going. Don’t really care. And it’s gonna tell me which candidate’s best.”
Well, we don’t know what bias that Chat GPT has, you’ve just got to be really careful about which aspects of your job you’re trying to automate away.
And also, where’s the value in the recruiter? The recruiter value is in their experience in the industry, and you know, their candidates, their connections, and the skill that they have there, so, you know, we don’t want to take that away and put that into AI.  That’s the skill bit. Really. What we should be doing is automating away the the boring, dull bits that nobody wants to do.


Yeah, I think I think you’re right. And I think I also add to that-  So we have a toolkit that we built at The Recruitment Network called the Cycle of Service Excellence, which is all about the user experience from a customer and candidate perspective and how they’re engaging with us. And I think a big thing I think of automation is as much about streamlining efficiencies and capacity for us as recruiters as businesses, but actually is improving the user experience at the other end, you know, and there’s no doubt in my mind. But the way candidates like to apply for jobs now, the way clients like to potentially interact with us or start the negotiation process with us. A lot of that is technology driven, as opposed to a human driven, and don’t get me wrong. I’m not here to say that we shouldn’t have recruiters getting out and speaking to customers., quite the opposite. We need to have a lot more of that. We are at the moment, but there is definitely an argument that there’s a journey piece that people like to go on. And it’s a little bit different, maybe, han what we’ve traditionally done in the past. 

So, there’s a question from Neil here, which I’m sure you’re gonna enjoy this one. So, “are apps being used in the recruitment sector?” – And if so, what sort of apps to add to that question – “And what type of impact are they having?”


Yeah, so I think some I’ll throw some some ideas out there:

Onboarding applications. So how do you simplify the process for candidates onboarding with your business? We see this a lot more in the, the temp space rather than the perm space. 

You might have job finding. So, you know, a matching app that matches candidates to existing roles.

You can have candidate and client portal applications. So simplifying that process of communicating between clients and candidates. Maybe a portal you can upload your CVs of potential candidates to, that are anonymised. And then, you know, maybe even timebox them. So once the client has seen them, they get automatically removed. Taking away some of that process work. 


Yeah, I’m thinking, this is something you’re working on currently around, um, sort of. I’ve got a theory about data loss prevention. DLP. It’s my opinion that a lot of data tends to kind of leak for people, move on right before recruitment consultants leave the door. And there’s obviously lots of stuff around AI that can be built around that right to say, “Oh, that looks odd that Johnny’s logged in from Dominican Republic at six o’clock in the evening and he’s downloading 20,000 CVs” or you know, that doesn’t look quite right.

Um, so there’s apps around that, you’re currently working on actually building an app around content filtering.

Do you want to cover that slightly?


Yeah. So I mean, one of the things that we’re building we’re looking at, um, for one of our customers monitoring what’s happening in the background of Bullhorn. So Bullhorn does have some audit capabilities, but we’re building a sort of a real-time reporting platform that will check what candidates somebody’s viewing, what activity they’re doing within Bullhorn at a particular time and then building automated, anomalous,  activity detection. 

So it looks like Johnny normally looks at five candidates and four clients an hour, but we’ve noticed a 5% increase, and therefore we can block that traffic. Or we can send a notification to his manager. Um, so that then you know, it’s rather than realising when Johnny’s gone out the door and moved on to a competitor that you’ve lost half your business ’cause Johnny took it with him. You know, you can stop that in real time and putting in place the the necessary, controls and fight it basically,

I think to answer the “what type of impact?” part of Neil’s question. A lot of it’s either increases in productivity, improvements in data security, lower spend and better experience whether that’s candidate experience, client experience. But fundamental to everything is freeing up people’s time. We we as tech people don’t want to be wasting our time on finance and sending invoices out, You know, recruiters probably don’t want to be spending time answering spam or dealing with stuff that isn’t what they love to do. It’s about freeing people up to do that stuff. And if we can do that with applications, it would be unique to every business. But that’s where the sweet spot is. It’s enabling people to do their best work all the time, rather than 50% of the time.


Yeah, we’ve done a lot of work over the last 12 to 18 months around this area called optimisation. So how do you squeeze more out of what you’ve already got? And we we created this thing called the Waste Elimination Checklist. It’s a very exciting name, but, ultimately the waste elimination checklist allows you to understand all those areas of wastage of efficiency. And again, if you can recruit that back and convert that back into more time out in front of customers, guess what? The expectations of a recruiter have shot up from a 180K average GP to a 220 K average GP. And so it goes on.

I’m very conscious of the time. We we’re gonna sort of round it off in a second because it’s been a great conversation and in trouble with these things you can you can go in 1000 different directions and talk about 1000 different things, right?

So, please make sure you reach out to Gareth and Craig. Have a good chat with them. And I know they love to chat. And they love to talk in particular about technology and recruitment, Technology and everything else. Do speak to them about it!

Just to close off the both of you – If I was to ask you both individually, what’s the one thing you’re really excited about when it comes to technology in our industry moving forward – outside of your ability to do a Rubik’s Cube using Bluetooth – What would that be?


Oh, that’s a good one.

I mean, it’s really cliche, but I think it has to be the generative AI piece, right?
I think it’s embedding that in something like a CRM, when Bullhorn releases something quite cool, I would imagine that’s gonna be a game changer, I think.


And for me, it’s integrations.  It’s products working better together. Um, I think Zapier has gone a long way to making that process easier. But I think there’s still a long way in the industry and generally to go and I think better solutions and joining together of solutions, is really, you know,  over the coming years, what would really be the best thing for recruitment. One-stop-shop single pane of glass products that fully automate all of the the bad stuff away. So you’re left with  just recruiting. Automation of timesheets, automation of finance and invoicing, automation of pay and bill… everything. That’s the bit that excites me.


Very good. Excellent.

Guys, really, really appreciate your time to say thank you.

Please do reach out to them. Their website is, have a good look at the website.

Reach out to to Craig and Gad have a good conversation with them, they’ve got lots more to share with you. Lots more ideas and that sort of stuff.

And for all of those of you listening, obviously, um, if you want to get involved with The Recruitment  Network, please reach out to us. I’d love to chat to you a bit more about what we’re up to around some of the optimisation stuff as well as the future of AI and tech stuff that we’ve been doing with our, create tech things.

Exciting times ahead, I think, without doubt, for our industry. And I do think this piece around technology has become more of a question than ever before. And I think if we can get an extra 25% more capacity out of our people in 2024 I can’t help thinking that many people are gonna have a record year in 2024 from a contribution and profitability perspective, as much as,  some of the vanity metrics of revenue and GP.

Craig. Gareth. Thanks for joining us. Lovely to see you all.

Thank you very much for joining us today, and we’re looking forward to seeing you on the next LinkedIn live.